Awaken Bible Prophecy Update 6-7-23: A Catechism, of Sorts, on Faith

As you can imagine, this isn’t an official catechism by any means, but it does more or less fit the description as put forth in Wikipedia:

A catechism, from Ancient Greek meaning “to teach orally”, is a summary or exposition of doctrine and serves as a learning introduction to . . . Christian religious teaching. Catechisms are doctrinal manuals – often in the form of questions followed by answers to be memorized – a format that has been used in non-religious or secular contexts as well.

With my version, it’s certainly not a doctrinal manual, nor do you have to memorize it.  I’m really calling it by this name because of the Q&A dialog I’m using, for better or for worse.  We could also describe it as a primer for how to dig into Scripture, which, when we do so, can yield surprising results.  You’ve seen some of that in my prior offerings whereby I discuss whether Once Saved, Always Saved is a valid position and if indeed the equation Salvation = Rapture holds true.  We won’t discuss these two issues directly today, but with their two ideals in mind, we’ll see how they hold up in this Q&A catechism-like format.

As I’ve stated a number of times, one of my objectives is to get folks to think, and not to just believe in a particular position because your pastor said it.  The questions we should all ask are: What does Scripture say?  What are the implications when we look at all sides of certain passages?  How might this affect what we’ve been led to believe simply because someone else said it and declared it true?

Just a word: In no way do I challenge salvation doctrine.  I hold an absolutely Biblical position with that as put forth in the Assemblies of God 16 Fundamental Truths.  What we’re examining today are certainly related, but with effectively peripheral issues like the ones stated a moment ago, there is room within traditional Christianity for different interpretations of Scripture.  I’m going to show you today how someone can come to an interpretation that may differ from yours.  If you’re up for the challenge, hang on.

Transcript:

As you can imagine, this isn’t an official catechism by any means, but it does more or less fit the description as put forth in Wikipedia:

A catechism, from Ancient Greek meaning “to teach orally”, is a summary or exposition of doctrine and serves as a learning introduction to . . . Christian religious teaching. Catechisms are doctrinal manuals – often in the form of questions followed by answers to be memorized – a format that has been used in non-religious or secular contexts as well.

With my version, it’s certainly not a doctrinal manual, nor do you have to memorize it.  I’m really calling it by this name because of the Q&A dialog I’m using, for better or for worse.  We could also describe it as a primer for how to dig into Scripture, which, when we do so, can yield surprising results.  You’ve seen some of that in my prior offerings whereby I discuss whether Once Saved, Always Saved is a valid position and if indeed the equation Salvation = Rapture holds true.  We won’t discuss these two issues directly today, but with their two ideals in mind, we’ll see how they hold up in this Q&A catechism-like format.

As I’ve stated a number of times, one of my objectives is to get folks to think, and not to just believe in a particular position because your pastor said it.  The questions we should all ask are: What does Scripture say?  What are the implications when we look at all sides of certain passages?  How might this affect what we’ve been led to believe simply because someone else said it and declared it true?

Just a word: In no way do I challenge salvation doctrine.  I hold an absolutely Biblical position with that as put forth in the Assemblies of God 16 Fundamental Truths.  What we’re examining today are certainly related, but with effectively peripheral issues like the ones stated a moment ago, there is room within traditional Christianity for different interpretations of Scripture.  I’m going to show you today how someone can come to an interpretation that may differ from yours.  If you’re up for the challenge, hang on.

First, let’s pray, we’ll read a Bible verse, and see what we come up with.

<PRAY>

Scripture [notice the dire statements in these verses]

1 Timothy 1:5-7,18-20

The aim of our charge is love that issues from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith. Certain persons, by swerving from these, have wandered away into vain discussion, desiring to be teachers of the law, without understanding either what they are saying or the things about which they make confident assertions.

This charge I entrust to you, Timothy, my child, in accordance with the prophecies previously made about you, that by them you may wage the good warfare, holding faith and a good conscience. By rejecting this, some have made shipwreck of their faith, among whom are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I have handed over to Satan that they may learn not to blaspheme.

1 Timothy 4:1

Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons . . .

1 Timothy 5:11-12,15

But refuse to enroll younger widows, for when their passions draw them away from Christ, they desire to marry and so incur condemnation for having abandoned their former faith.

For some have already strayed after Satan.

1 Timothy 6:10,20-21

For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evils. It is through this craving that some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pangs.

O Timothy, guard the deposit entrusted to you. Avoid the irreverent babble and contradictions of what is falsely called “knowledge,” for by professing it some have swerved from the faith.

James 4:4

You adulterous people! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God.

A Catechism, of Sorts, on Faith

• Just a word before I begin: This is a longer Update today by necessity.
• I cover a lot of material in depth with a lot of Scripture.
• Because of that, I’d like to recommend that after listening you pull up the transcript on my website, go back through the many Bible passages, and think deeply about what I’ve said in relation to them.
• You still may not agree with my conclusions, but engaging in this way is exactly what it means to be a Berean.
• Today, we’ll cover multiple aspects of faith in this Prophecy Update, so the topics will seemingly be all over the board – yet, hopefully, everything will be related to our general inquiry
• I’ll try to break issues down by topic and see how that goes

Salvation – New Testament

• Q – How are we saved according to the Gospel in the New Testament?
• A – The Romans Road lays out the guidelines with the ABCs of salvation:
  • A – Acknowledge you’re a sinner (& repent!) – Romans 3:10,23;6:23
  • B – Believe in your heart that Jesus Christ is God; that He died on the cross and shed His blood so as to take all of our sins upon Himself; and that He rose from the dead – Romans 10:9-10
  • C – Call upon the Name of the Lord (confess Jesus as your Savior and Lord) – Romans 10:9-10,13
• Q – What is required of us for salvation?
• A – Nothing but faith, just as Ephesians 2:8-9 Salvation is by God’s grace alone and not by any works that we do – except to believe.
• Q – Once we’ve truly been born-again, what does the Lord require of us?
• A – He expects us to walk by the Holy Spirit of God as the Apostle Paul states in Galatians 5:16-18. This means that we should be obedient to God as he commands.
• Here is a good summary of this that came through my email:

• Throughout the entire scriptures (from Genesis through Revelation), there is an extremely important word that is said repeatedly which most pastors intentionally skip, and that word is “IF”.
• The scriptures make it clear constantly that we have a choice.  
• IF we continuously follow and obey Him until our death, we will be saved
• (Matthew 24:13 “But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.”
• Mark 13:13“And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.”)
• IF we hear His voice AND follow Him, He will give us eternal life (John 10:27)
• IF you want to be Jesus’ friend, you will do whatever He commands you (John 15:14)
• IF you want to abide in Jesus’ Love, you will keep His commandments(John 15:10)
• IF you do the will of the Father, the same is Jesus’ brother, sister, and mother (Matt 12:50)

• Q – How do we know we are walking in the way of the Lord
• A – We exhibit the Fruit of the Spirit as Paul states in Galatians 5:22-23. Having the Fruit of the Spirit results in someone obeying the Ten Commandment as best he can because he wants to obey them.

Salvation – Old Testament

• Q – Before Jesus came in the flesh, how were people (primarily Jews, but not exclusively) saved in Old Testament times?
• A – They were required to follow the Law of Moses, i.e. the Ten Commandments
• Q – If someone religiously followed the Law in his outward practice but didn’t adhere to God’s commands inwardly with his heart, was he saved?
• A – No. Jesus demonstrated this in His interactions with the Pharisees and specifically when He discussed with Nicodemus how one is born again per John 3:1-21.  To see the kingdom of God, one must be born again by the Spirit of God.  In other words, his heart must change and be toward God.  If he does not receive that Spirit and his heart isn’t for God, he is – or remains – condemned.
• Q – How did people during the Old Testament period receive the Spirit of God when all they had was the Law and not the Words and example of Jesus?
• A – The Law was intended to be a tutor, or schoolmaster, to people per Galatians 3:24; the Law was also a perfect mirror reflecting our sinful condition as seen in Romans 3:20;7:7.
• Q – How would the Law acting as a tutor or mirror bring someone to saving faith?
• A – It would change his heart toward God so as to follow the Ten Commandments, in fact, to want to follow them. Most importantly, this meant that someone believed solely in God Almighty and no other gods (Commandment #1).  As fruit of this belief, such a person would not bow down to or revere any idol representing a pagan god (Commandment #2).
• Q – In practice, what did this look like?
• A – King David is the Biblical example for this as Acts 13:22 He was a man after God’s own heart.  This means that he followed only Yahweh, the God of the Bible, and no other god.  Even in his sin, David did not turn away from Yahweh to follow any other god.

We can also see this devotion in the person of Job when his wife told him to curse God for his troubles in Job 2:9-10.  He refused and rebuked her for such foolishness.  He would honor God alone despite his circumstances.  Salvation regardless of the point in time, i.e. OT or NT, is always a heart issue.

• Q – Is there a term we can use to describe the faithfulness of such men as David and Job?
• A – Yes. The term “believing loyalty” encompasses this kind of faith.  Someone with believing loyalty believes in God alone and is faithful to Him alone.  This concept is captured in Isaiah 51:7:

“Listen to me, you who know righteousness,
    the people in whose heart is my law . . .”

There it is again: The key to believing loyalty is to have the Law of God in one’s heart.

God in the Old Testament and New Testament

• Q – Many people distinguish God in the Old Testament as different from His portrayal in the New Testament. How valid is this?
• A – It’s not valid whatsoever. People who think this way see the coming of Jesus in the flesh as the manifestation and personification of God as love.  They don’t see Jesus in the Old Testament, and as a result think that He wasn’t part of people’s lives, and certainly didn’t walk among them in those times.  This couldn’t be more wrong.

Hebrews 13:8 is our proof text for this: Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.  This tells us that the God in ancient times was the same as when Jesus walked the earth in the flesh, and is no different today.  In fact, Jesus was very present during the Old Testament era; it’s simply that Christians don’t see Him in that manner because He didn’t come at that time in the flesh.

The truth is that Jesus, as the 2^nd Person of the Trinity, was present and visible to many people.  It could be said that His appearances then far exceed those today.  The way the pre-incarnate Jesus came at that time is simply described differently because He wasn’t yet born into the human realm.  The Father is Spirit and no one sees Him (John 6:44).  In contrast a God figure shows up all over the Old Testament.  This is none other than Jesus as the Angel of the Lord, the Word, the Name, the Commander of the Lord’s Army, a “man” who Abram recognized as divine, and many other instances.  This divine figure – the pre-incarnate Jesus – physically appeared to the prophets; He spoke with Moses face-to-face.  There’s no question that He made Himself and His will – the will of God, and His love – known.  He was quite specific as to what He expected of His people, namely that they should walk in all His commands and not worship any other gods.  What He spoke about and required of His people was and is no different than what Jesus in the flesh conveyed and that the Holy Spirit demands of us today in order to be considered a true follower of Jesus Christ.

Ezekiel as a Watchman

• Q – What did God require Ezekiel to do?
• A – God’s directions were for him to speak to His people, the house of Israel.
• Q – What was God’s declaration regarding Ezekiel’s mission?
• A – His people would not listen because they were exceedingly stubborn and rebellious. Nonetheless, Ezekiel was to bring God’s Word to them as warning.  God acknowledged that many in Israel would hear but refuse to receive His wise counsel.
• Q – Who did God say would be those to whom Ezekiel spoke his warning?
• A – There were two groups within the house of Israel:
  • #1 – The wicked. These were Israelites who had rejected the Word of God
    • Q – What was God’s warning regarding the wicked and His warning to Ezekiel?
    • A – God said that the wicked would surely die for their iniquity.
      • If Ezekiel didn’t warn them, he would be held liable for their wickedness, and their blood would be on his hand.
      • If Ezekiel did warn them, and the wicked didn’t turn away from their iniquity, their death was all on them, yet Ezekiel would be spared for his faithfulness.
      • If the wicked repented and turned from their iniquity because of Ezekiel’s warning, their souls would be saved and Ezekiel would likewise be delivered
    • #2 – Those who were righteous. These were Israelites who could be considered to have believing loyalty.  The Law was in their hearts.  Righteousness in OT times is equivalent with salvation today in the NT dispensation.
      • Q – What was God’s warning to the righteous?
      • A – If a righteous person trespassed against God and His Law, God’s decree was that he would die for his iniquity.
        • This person’s righteousness would not deliver him from having egregiously sinned.
        • God declared that for a righteous person to trust in his righteousness while doing injustice (i.e. this was a stumbling block), that trust was misplaced. God would not see him as righteous any longer; i.e. his righteous deeds would not be remembered by God and he would die in his sin.
        • If Ezekiel did not warn such a person, his blood would be upon Ezekiel as a watchman who failed in his duty.
        • If Ezekiel warned the righteous man who trespassed and he turned back from that iniquity, God would deliver him; neither would there be blood upon Ezekiel’s hand because he was faithful in the task God gave him.
        • If Ezekiel warned the righteous to turn from his sins and he ignored the warning from Ezekiel, the man would die but Ezekiel would be spared.
      • Q – What did God mean by equating a stumbling block with the act of doing injustice?
      • A – The Hebrew word mikshol is defined as something that “caused to fall, offense, nothing offered, ruin, stumbling-block.” It is the means or the occasion of stumbling; it is of the heart.  The implication appears to be one of continued stumbling, leading to calamity, because of the condition of one’s heart (i.e. this person was turned away from God and not desiring to please Him).
      • Q – You equated a righteous person with one who is saved, i.e. born-again. Why?
      • A – As noted previously, God does not change. His love and grace are the same from everlasting to everlasting.  Given the nature of God, this means that only the terminology has changed from the OT to the NT.  If righteousness meant that someone who died would eventually come into the presence of the Lord – which it did – and salvation means the same, then the terms are effectively synonymous.

If OT Righteousness = NT Salvation, and a person in the OT pre-Christ era could sin grievously enough to lose his righteousness, i.e. to die without God, then someone in NT Christian times, who is saved could likewise turn from God.  He could deliberately and repeatedly commit grievous sins such that the Law of God no longer ruled and reigned in his heart, thus choosing to spurn the grace of God and His merciful salvation.

In both cases the presumption of trusting in God’s grace while committing “stumbling-block-sins”, i.e. grieving God by choosing to trespass without repentance, will not save that person.  Today, we call one aspect of this hyper-grace, and it is not Biblical.

Apostasy – OT & NT

• Q – The Bible warns repeatedly against the act of apostasy. What does the word actually mean?
• A – There appear to be two Hebrew words describing apostasy. The first is sarah meaning “turning aside, defection, apostasy, withdrawal”.  The second is meshubah meaning “turning back, apostasy.”

A key verse for sarah is Isaiah 31:6:

Turn to him from whom people have deeply revolted [sarah], O children of Israel.

A key verse for meshubah is Jeremiah 3:6:

The Lord said also unto me in the days of Josiah the king, Hast thou seen that which backsliding [meshubah] Israel hath done? She is gone up upon every high mountain and under every green tree, and there hath played the harlot.

• Q – Since these definitions in the OT describe apostasy as defection and turning away, i.e. a backsliding condition, how should we understand their implication?
• A – There appears to be a strong correlation regarding these definitions of apostasy with the description in Ezekiel 3 & 33 with a righteous man who turns away in iniquity and trespasses against God’s Law. If we understand that God’s law must be in the heart of someone in OT times for him to be considered worthy of entering God’s Kingdom, thus effectively being born-again if we use NT terminology, then apostasy would mean that a person has turned from God’s law in his heart.  He has backslidden into a sinful condition of iniquity and trespass against God, which carries the dire consequence of (soul) death if not corrected.
• Q – Why would God threaten a righteous man with death if he doesn’t renounce the wickedness that has become iniquity?
• A – God’s love is so great that it grieves Him when someone chooses to walk away from His grace and mercy. Sometimes the carrot is not enough; there must be a stick.  In other words, when God’s goodness, which has led to a person’s repentance is renounced, God must have a means of getting that person’s attention, showing him the consequences of his actions, and attempting to recapture a person’s loyalty.  That may only come through hard measures, and there is no guarantee that through that person’s free will, he will repent and return.
• Q – What are the means by which God attempts to remind a person of the consequences of his backsliding?
• A – God may bring a gentle rebuke and correction. He may need to do something harder in His disciplining actions, such as bringing trials and tribulations into a person’s life.  As a last resort, God may bring severe punishment in the hopes that such a person will see how miserable his life is without God.  However, just as the people of Israel were described as a stiff-necked people, there are those whose rebellion is set against God and they will not relent from following their own Godless path.  This is true apostasy.

These efforts by God are actually a great mercy from Him as our loving Savior.  He knows how detrimental it is for someone to walk continually in sin.  How much worse is it for a person to have been saved and then to live his life sinfully as if he hadn’t been saved?  God desires a course correction for this person and will do whatever is necessary to accomplish it.  However, the sad fact is that our free will and stubbornness may cause such a person to deliberately spurn God.  If he does so, it will be to his detriment.  Here is Hebrews 6:4-8 speaking of this:

For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt. For land that has drunk the rain that often falls on it, and produces a crop useful to those for whose sake it is cultivated, receives a blessing from God. But if it bears thorns and thistles, it is worthless and near to being cursed, and its end is to be burned.

• Q – What is an example of God’s harsh measures to bring someone back to Him through a fiery trial such that the person does what God requires, i.e. changes her heart appropriately in order to enter God’s kingdom fully prepared for His glory?
• A – I personally knew a woman whom I’ll call Cathy – not her real name. Cathy was absolutely saved; a faithful and enthusiastic worshiper of God.  She developed Stage 4 cancer and over a couple years finally went downhill physically.  Cathy’s pain became intense, she became bedridden, and wanted nothing more than to die.  However, she had hidden unforgiveness that God required her to deal with.

In the extended weeks of lying in bed in excruciating pain, Cathy refused to forgive her mother for significant issues in their past.  God told Cathy that He would not allow her to die to come home to Him until she had forgiven her mother.  Because she wouldn’t, God allowed her to linger and suffer.

Why would He do this?  I believe it’s because each believer must have a certain purity in their faith so that when they enter the eternal state with God, their reward will be as He wants it to be.  A person’s free will choices are an integral aspect of this situation.

How do I know about this about these circumstances?  A friend of mine – a man of God – heard from the Lord that he should go and speak to Cathy.  The Lord told him that another servant had been given this same task, but refused to honor it.  God’s plan B was to use my friend in this regard.  My friend was faithful and went to Cathy’s home where she lay in great torment.  He spoke to her husband and received permission to speak to Cathy.  At her bedside, my friend told her of the Word he’d been given.  God would not allow her to die to relieve this terrible pain until she forgave her mother.

Hearing this requirement come from a third party speaking on behalf of God, giving her the same message He had previously imparted to her, finally brought Cathy to the point of repentance and forgiveness.  She let go of that which she’d been holding in her heart against her mother.  Cathy repented as God required her to do so as to release her to death.  That very night Cathy died.

• Q – What is the lesson from this very difficult narrative?
• A – God’s love requires a certain attitude of the heart from those whom He calls His children. They must be repentant, and they must forgive those who harm or persecute them.  An integral aspect of this is when someone follows another god rather than surrendering wholly to the God of the Bible.  God will do what is necessary to bring about this heart condition, even to the point of allowing great suffering until such a person chooses to stop doing what she wants and to finally do what God deems necessary.
• Q – Gotquestions.org takes the position that there is not true apostasy in Christianity; that those who become apostate only made a profession of Christian faith but were never truly born-again. Is that the case?
• A – There are numerous Scriptures that seem to argue one way or the other about this, which is why there’s room to dispute the idea of Once Saved, Always Saved, and Salvation = Rapture. Some Bible passages appear to clearly declare that true believers have eternal security and that nothing can change that.  Oddly enough, there are also many verses that contradict this possibility.

I personally have argued that a person’s free will is at the center of this debate.  If God gave His spiritual sons free will and they rebelled (Genesis 6,11; Deuteronomy 32:8 ESV) – despite being in the midst of God’s glory in heaven – then how much more possible is it for God’s human creation – those who become believers destined for heaven – to exercise their free will and make the choice to turn away from God’s grace and mercy?

God promises to keep us to the end.  That is true.  This promise is solely on His part.  God will never turn from this promise.  However, if someone determines that he no longer wishes to receive God’s grace and salvation, God honors that free will choice.  God will do everything he can to keep that person within His kingdom as noted previously with various disciplining actions, e.g. rebuke, correction, and punishment.  Yet, despite this, if someone is bound and determined to sin and walk away from God, the Lord will ultimately allow him to make that choice and go his own way.  God will never force someone to go to heaven.  Neither will there be any unbelievers in the eternal state with Him.

Q – What are some Scripture verses that give us a warning not to disdain God’s free gift of salvation?

A – There are many.  Consider just the following:

Hebrews 5:11 – 6:12 (part of this previously quoted)

About this we have much to say, and it is hard to explain, since you have become dull of hearing. For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the basic principles of the oracles of God. You need milk, not solid food, for everyone who lives on milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, since he is a child. But solid food is for the mature, for those who have their powers of discernment trained by constant practice to distinguish good from evil.

Therefore let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, and of instruction about washings, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. And this we will do if God permits. For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt. For land that has drunk the rain that often falls on it, and produces a crop useful to those for whose sake it is cultivated, receives a blessing from God. But if it bears thorns and thistles, it is worthless and near to being cursed, and its end is to be burned.

Though we speak in this way, yet in your case, beloved, we feel sure of better things—things that belong to salvation. For God is not unjust so as to overlook your work and the love that you have shown for his name in serving the saints, as you still do. And we desire each one of you to show the same earnestness to have the full assurance of hope until the end, so that you may not be sluggish, but imitators of those who through faith and patience inherit the promises.

• Q – What is the gist of this passage?
• A – The writer of Hebrews admonishes those in Christ to delve deeper into their faith. He warns of those who have saving faith.  These believers have been enlightened . . . [they] have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God.  Despite this, they have fallen away.  In such a case, Paul says that it is impossible for God to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.

These believers in being enlightened are obviously those who have made a true profession of saving faith, yet they wasted it by spurning the goodness of God.

For the Hebrews themselves as the focus of this letter, the writer believes that in their case, such falling away will not happen as it has and can with a subset of believers.

Further Warnings Against Apostasy

Q – What other examples does the Bible provide about this serious situation?

A – Here are several with brief comments:

Colossians 1:21-23

And you, who once were alienated and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds, he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him, if indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Notice the key word in this verse as in all of God’s promises – whether to the Israelites or to Christian believers.  That key word is “if”.  God’s promises are always conditional upon the human element.  God won’t forsake His side of the promise; however, humanity operating in sinful flesh can and often does.  Read Deuteronomy 28 to see this conditional if-then equation in regard to God’s promises to Israel.

In these verses, the conditional “if” means that only upon the believers continuing in true faith and not turning back from the hope of the gospel will they remain holy and blameless and above reproach before him.  This means that they can choose God’s reproach despite what they’ve been given by Him.

Colossians 3:5-10

Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: sexual immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. On account of these the wrath of God is coming. In these you too once walked, when you were living in them. But now you must put them all away: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and obscene talk from your mouth. Do not lie to one another, seeing that you have put off the old self with its practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator. Here there is not Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave, free; but Christ is all, and in all.

Paul says the Colossians must put away these sinful behaviors.  Why would he warn them of this unless some would not put them away?  Is it possible for some of those warned to choose to continue along this path of sin?  Is not human flesh willful to the extreme?  Will everyone who believes hear the warnings and heed them by embracing the new self rather than the old self?  Obviously not.

Colossians 3:12-17

Put on then, as God’s chosen ones, holy and belove compassionate hearts, kindness, humility, meekness, and patience, bearing with one another and, if one has a complaint against another, forgiving each other; as the Lord has forgiven you, so you also must forgive. And above all these put on love, which binds everything together in perfect harmony. And let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body. And be thankful. Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. And whatever you do, in word or deed, do everything in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him.

What if they don’t do all these Godly actions?  Will God try to correct them, possibly rebuke them, or in the extreme punish them, for willfully ignoring that which He deems holy and necessary?  Of course, He will.  Sometimes ever-increasing measures of hardship are necessary to get people’s attention.

Colossians 3:25

For the wrongdoer will be paid back for the wrong he has done, and there is no partiality.

This verse seems to answer the previous question as to whether or not God will take active measures against someone for his deliberately sinful actions.  Remember, Paul is speaking to the church, to believers, to brothers in Christ.  Christians have an obligation to walk as God commands.  By not doing so, there are consequences.

Q – It appears as if avoiding apostasy requires a works-based faith.  That contradicts Ephesians 2:8-9 and many other verses which assure us that true faith is only through the grace of God and not by works.  How do you answer this charge?

A – There are two points in time that we have to consider:

1. Pre-faith
2. Post-coming-to-faith

1. Pre-faith is the time in which we are all unbelievers, secular, walking in darkness, and ruled by Satan and the gods of this age. In this situation God imposes no preconditions.  He requires no works on our part.  He asks for nothing – no obligations, sacrifices, etc. – only that we believe in Him, and place our whole trust in the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross.  In this, we give Him our heart.  Fini – French for done – finished.
2. Post-coming-to-faith is another animal altogether. Once we have confessed Jesus as our Savior and Lord, we now have the requirement – the obligation – to walk in obedience to the Lord’s commands.  But is it not the “work” of the heart to please God through obeying His commands?  This now puts the onus on us and it indeed looks like a works-requirement.  In reality, it’s no different than in our pre-faith condition.  Just as turning to Jesus initially requires a tender and repentant heart, so does the ongoing obligation of our continued faith walk.  Now that we know who Jesus is, we must exercise believing loyalty.  We do that easily because of the Holy Spirit now indwelling us.  We obey the commands of the Lord, we exhibit the Fruit of the Holy Spirit, and we emulate Jesus in our lives

However, as is often said, God is a gentleman.  He does not force us to do anything on His behalf.  Despite someone having the Holy Spirit, it is certainly possible for that person to ignore Him and to decide to pollute his faith by believing other doctrines set forth by other gods.  He may adopt New Age practices, or blend Christianity with Islam to compromise with Chrislam as a belief system.  He does these things through his free-will choices, moving further and further away from God, and potentially getting to the point of grieving the Holy Spirit.  Note Ephesians 4:30-32:

And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you, along with all malice. Be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God in Christ forgave you.

If we’re warned against doing it by acting as noted here, that means we certainly can, and many have over the years.

Similarly, Israel did the same as Isaiah 63:9-10 states:

In all their affliction he was afflicted,
and the angel of his presence saved them;
in his love and in his pity he redeemed them;
he lifted them up and carried them all the days of old.

But they rebelled
and grieved his Holy Spirit;
therefore he turned to be their enemy,
and himself fought against them.

God in effect becomes our enemy when we grieve the Holy Spirit.  His love is so great that He must take drastic action when we abuse that love.  There’s a point that God’s patience wears out – whether with Israel in the past or with Christians today who exploit and ignore His love.  As Isaiah 63:19 says:

We have become like those over whom you have never ruled,
like those who are not called by your name.

Consider Paul’s warning in 2 Thessalonians 3:6-15:

Now we command you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is walking in idleness and not in accord with the tradition that you received from us. For you yourselves know how you ought to imitate us, because we were not idle when we were with you, nor did we eat anyone’s bread without paying for it, but with toil and labor we worked night and day, that we might not be a burden to any of you. It was not because we do not have that right, but to give you in ourselves an example to imitate. For even when we were with you, we would give you this command: If anyone is not willing to work, let him not eat. For we hear that some among you walk in idleness, not busy at work, but busybodies. Now such persons we command and encourage in the Lord Jesus Christ to do their work quietly and to earn their own living.

As for you, brothers, do not grow weary in doing good. If anyone does not obey what we say in this letter, take note of that person, and have nothing to do with him, that he may be ashamed. Do not regard him as an enemy, but warn him as a brother.

Paul warns against idleness among those who are brothers in Christ in the church.  What is idleness?  Strong’s #814 is the Greek word ataktós.  It means properly, disorderly (“breaking rank”); insubordinate to God’s Word and hence fruitless (unproductive) – because lacking proper order (discipline).

This is a strong theological warning.  What does Paul say for someone who persists in this condition?  He is a brother; he must be warned.  Why?  Living such a life will bring serious consequences.

• Q – Is there a NT example of someone who walked away from God?
• A – Yes, there are several. Specifically, we see that in a man named Demas.  Paul writing to his young disciple warns of the problem of someone falling away in 1 Timothy 6:20-21:

O Timothy, guard the deposit entrusted to you. Avoid the irreverent babble and contradictions of what is falsely called “knowledge,” for by professing it some have swerved from the faith.

Subsequently we observe the faithfulness of brother Demas in Colossians 4:14 as Paul describes those who are serving the Lord well:

Luke the beloved physician greets you, as does Demas.

In Paul’s letter to Philemon 1:23-24, we also see a commendation of Demas with other brothers of the faith and serving well:

Epaphras, my fellow prisoner in Christ Jesus, sends greetings to you, and so do Mark, Aristarchus, Demas, and Luke, my fellow workers.

However, later something changed as Paul states in 2 Timothy 4:10:

For Demas, in love with this present world, has deserted me and gone to Thessalonica.

Demas has done exactly what Paul said could happen.  Demas became enchanted by so-called worldly knowledge and chose to go back into the world out of God’s grace, in effect choosing to do what the church at Corinth was required to do with the believer who was living an adulteress life.  1 Corinthians 5 details this situation.  Note v2:

Let him who has done this be removed from among you.

Note also v5:

you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord.

Once more, here is v11-13:

But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. “Purge the evil person from among you.”

This is extremely serious behavior from one who is a brother, i.e. a born-again believer.  Does this same situation not apply to other true believers who walk deliberately in sin?  Are there not consequences?  Might those be extraordinarily serious at this end of the age?  If this free will choice of a sinful lifestyle isn’t corrected by the believer prior to the Rapture or before he dies, what might that mean for him?  This is a hard question.  Don’t ignore the implications.  God will deal with this person one way or the other.  Godly warnings not heeded will result in something extremely unpleasant for such a person as the Lord attempts to set him straight and walking once more a holy path.

Conclusion

Q – What is the takeaway from all this?

A – The potential of harming our relationship with God is very real.    Recall the Scriptures I noted at the beginning of this Update.  When we disobey Him, we are subject to whatever he deems necessary to bring us back into a loving relationship with Him.  This might mean significant trials and tribulations, or as the OT describes for Israel: to endure the fiery furnace.  Those who follow Jesus Christ and disdain their great salvation are absolutely subject to God’s refining them in the fire in their backslidden faith.  They should expect nothing else because of the immense love God has for us with His plans and purposes for all eternity.  That might mean temporal, i.e. earthly discomfort or pain, when we ignore God’s pleas to walk in all His ways.

Q – What you’re describing sounds similar to the Catholic concept of purgatory.  Is that what you’re referring to?

A – Absolutely not!  The idea of purgatory is a man-made, non-Biblical concept of a supernatural state for purification where someone is basically suspended between heaven and hell.  The Bible states clearly that the purification necessary for some believers occurs in the body in this natural world.  This is an earthly battle with its subsequent cleansing.  Believers are warned time and again to walk faithfully and obediently with the Lord.  Not doing so has consequences, not related to rewards or crowns, e.g. being handed over to the world and Satan.

Q – What should our thinking and approach be to a sinful lifestyle we observe in a known believer?

A – We err greatly if we submit to the idea of hyper-grace, whereby when a person is saved, he can do anything sinful, and God’s grace will cover it.  It is obvious that God does not look upon this situation as far too many in the church do.  He will act to attempt to cause their repentance and return to Him through whatever means necessary.  In the end, some will come back to Him and so enter the eternal kingdom; whereas there are others whose stiff neck and iron brow will prevent them from surrendering to God’s love, grace, and mercy.  As a result, they will suffer consequences that may be severe.

Our obligation as fellow believers is to bring warning to our brothers and sisters in Christ if they walk in presumption of God’s grace.  God requires that of each of us.  Let us not neglect this very important duty to the Lord.  Remember, when we are faithful and do our duty, there is no guilt and blood upon our hands.

Apostasy is real and it’s increasing.  There’s a reason for the significant decline of those who believe in a true Biblical doctrine.  If people weren’t turning away from it, there wouldn’t be a decline; it’s a simple as that.  Keep that in mind as you think on these issues.

Remember also that these are warnings for those who spurn the grace and mercy of God and deliberately sin.  For those of us loving God, obeying Him, and not deliberately and consistently rebelling against His commands, we have nothing to be concerned about.  In this case, yes: Once Saved, Always Saved, plus Salvation = Rapture are absolutely true doctrines.

Be a watchman.  Stay faithful.  Hold to God’s Word in season and out despite the pressures all around.  I’m speaking to myself as well as to all of you.  Because we have little strength, let us allow the Holy Spirit to enable us to get through the remainder of these trying times.  By relying on Him, this dire problem of apostasy will not come our way because God will indeed keep us.